The Call for Evidence is now on the school website - in the same inaccessible spot as the terms of reference.
Home page -> Information for Parents -> School Policies and other Information -> Call for Evidence by Lord Carlile QC
Let me make it easier for you. It is here.
It has the same form of words as the advert in the Gazette, with the
same 28 day time limit, but the document is undated, so you can't tell when the 28 days started.
You couldn't make it up!
Tuesday, 5 October 2010
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The OPA mailing list was contacted about 40 minutes ago giving a postal address and also an e-mail address
ReplyDeleteA step in the right direction albeit they needed prompting.
ReplyDeleteThis evening's London Evening Standard (free edition) carries a story about the Carlile Inquiry. Online edition: http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23885239-catholic-school-appeals-for-help-to-stop-further-abuse.do
ReplyDeleteCatholic school appeals for help to stop further abuse
ReplyDeleteGreat headline - shame the article forgot to mention the school had recycled known perpetrators without informing the authorities (DfE/DfEE/DCSF/DfE/ISA) in breach of primary legislation. This permitted the perpetrators to have immediate access to children again unknown to the the the school/s that hired them or the DfE.
No it's true - You could not make it up!
The St Benedict's way.
So if the school breached legislation, does that mean they have broken the law? Is it a matter for the police?
ReplyDeleteIt's a matter of waiting to see what action the DfE is going to take - many people are looking on with interest none more so I suspect than Adrian McAllister the Chief Executive of the Independent Safeguarding Authority.
ReplyDeleteNice, healthy member of society blogging about a place he knows little to nothing about, under the pretentious heading 'Confessions of a Sceptic' - as though he has carefully attended to his own moral state first.
ReplyDeletePiffle, but nasty piffle.
Best relieve yourself of the burden, JW, before it affects your wholesomeness.
I'm surprised to see the Abbey posting here again. After the other week, when the discussion became really quite nasty, I thought perhaps they had realised that it did nothing at all for their image to be biting back and trying to match abuse with abuse. Any parent reading their comments will be disturbed that the school should mount this kind of campaign against this blog. Doesn't it just show how limited the management are in responding to criticism, and how nasty-minded the culture is at this school?
ReplyDeleteThe Abbey posting here? Oh, and what proof do you have? The Abbey has its supporters who recognize that all is not bad there and that the Abbey is determined that past wrongs are not going to be repeated. The Abbey has supporters who recognize this and they are perfectly entitled to comment.
ReplyDelete.
ReplyDeleteAnd where is the evidence that past wrongs are not going to be repeated?
Please don't quote Carlile - put evidence in front of us, all of us would be keen to read and consider it be assured.
Unsupported words assuring change do not cut the mustard.
This subject it is one of detail, and on the abusee side of the table we all know the practicalities that need to be put in place to evince change.
Here is your opportunity to put up!
I'm neither abbey supporter nor abbey detractor. However, I recall a number of serious charges were recently made against the sponsor of this blog. They related to Mr West's dealings with young children and his apparent total disregard for any safeguarding procedures. Before further condemning others could he please address these accusations?
ReplyDeleteWell 12.21 you failed to 'put up' evidence to support your assertion "the Abbey is determined that past wrongs are not going to be repeated," so yet another meaningless platitude to add to the many made by the Church that has an aversion to demonstrable change across its estate to protect children despite the vacuous rhetoric from Rome, Westminster and belatedly the Abbey.
ReplyDeleteBut at least you have the opportunity on this site to freely express your opinions and innuendo without moderation.
Have a pleasant weekend.
I don't know who you think 12.21 might be, Mr West...but you have got it wrong. What I was asking for is a little clarification from you. Were the rather serious accusations made by your former neighbour true or not? This is a simple enough request and has nothing to do with 'Rome, Westminster...or...the Abbey'.
ReplyDeleteCome on West. You have been quick enough to criticise St Benedict's and the Catholic Church. Very serious allegations have been made against you, so, are they true or as false as your claim that Father Greg was arrested. Remember that? Your 'source in the diocese of Westminster' Maybe a few whiskeys too many that time? and the others as well?
ReplyDeleteSurely the only person here who's had 'a few too many whiskeys' is Father Gregory Chillman? He certainly did in my time at St Benedict's, particularly when headmaster (perhaps he couldn't cope with the pressure). It was quite revolting to have to stand in assembly in the Annexe and hear him lecturing us, all the while breathing pure alcohol over the assembled boys. However, there's no truth in the rumour that the cleaners had to hide the Mr Sheen from him - his alcohol was all good stuff, and paid for by the parents of the boys that he dismally failed to inspire, educate, or indeed, protect from his paedophile buddy David 'Maurice' Pearce. What a school.
ReplyDeleteMr West, surely you realize that it’s imperative that you respond in some fashion to the serious questions that have been raised vis-à-vis your own past behaviour in relation to children? For someone so eager to criticise others your tardiness is amazing....or is it?
ReplyDeleteCome on West, time for explanations. You have had plenty of opportunities to deny the allegations. Explain yourself.
ReplyDeleteMr West is very free when it comes to explaining the actions and motivations of others, but is quite incapable, it seems, of explaining himself! It really is something of a sick joke!
ReplyDeletePerhaps some of the other suggestions about West are true....if he can't deny allegations, what can we think?
ReplyDeleteWhat we think is pretty obvious!
ReplyDeleteI am surprised to see nothing about the Carlile Enquiry on the front page of the school's website.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.stbenedicts.org.uk/
I am also surprised to see this statement:
"Since its foundation in 1902 the name of St Benedict’s has resonated with its distinctive blend of history, tradition and academic excellence."
As the school was founded as Ealing Priory School and that remained it's name till 1948 when it was renamed "ST BENEDICTS".
As I recall it was John Maestri who claimed that he had insisted that they insert the apostrophe.
Well perhaps, just perhaps, the school isn't as totally obsessed with the matter as certain people on this blog. The problems associated with St Benedict's extend far beyond the school - maybe we could hear a little more about Mr West's purported involvement? His own silence on the matter is, as they say, deafening.
ReplyDeleteI see Jonathan is still desperately scouring St Ben's web site for something - anything - that might just detract from his own little problems. Oh dear, oh dear!
ReplyDelete.
ReplyDeleteAn article in The Times that parents with children in education should consider.
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Abbey supporters, isn't this rather pathetic? You are insinuating that JW is somehow implicated in child abuse. Stop faffing around and just put it in to clear words.
ReplyDeleteThen, further, take JW's own advice and if you believe some sort of offence has been committed go straight to the police.
But you won't, will you? I wonder why? Could be that instead some low-level insinuations suit you better, eh? Repeat: If you think an offence has been committed, REPORT IT. Go on - grow a pair and put up or shut up.
It's not a matter of anyone 'thinking' or 'insinuating' but of having been specifically 'informed', on this blog, by one of Mr West's own, former, friends!!
ReplyDeleteCRI DE COEUR
ReplyDeleteWould people please stop attacking Mr West! His carefully crafted self-image is, surely, an inspiration to us all. Please do not let us now destroy it. If Mr West has things to hide, one or two ‘skeletons in his cupboard’, that’s his business. If, for instance, at some time in the past, swept away by the beauty of his music making, he indulged in things that were, let us say, not quite musical, then, so be it. I personally remain convinced, given the self-image he has presented of a courageous, noble, upright spirit, undeterred by the wickedness of others, that whatever he did or did not do was done ‘not like the rest of men’ but with purity of heart and intent. So, please do not continue to push this poor innocent man for explanations or answers to silly accusations and questions and, I have to say, the suggestion above, that someone might ‘report him to the police’ leaves me quite horrified! Is there nothing but rottenness in the state of Denmark?
You people attacking Mr. West would serve the schools, the churchs and most importantly the PUPILS (past, present and future!) interests a lot better by relenting from said personal attacks (be they overt, covert or indeed subtle and/or ironic, like the last funny fellow), and instead try mounting a more honest and robust defence of the school and the church.
ReplyDelete12:52 makes a good point, but West, by his refusal to comment on serious allegations surely brings into question his credibility and his motivation.
ReplyDeleteAbandoning his lover and son and the dodgy music lessons, surely You couldn't make it up??
Despite Mr West's many statements to contrary, the school and the church do not need defending. They have their faults, acknowledged and well publicised in both cases, and they are, again whatever Mr West might say to the contrary, being carefully looked into and corrected. I can only ask 14:14 - what more, short of shooting all concerned, can anyone do?
ReplyDeleteOkay, West isn't really worth bothering about. Most of us can, I'm sure, agree on that. But his attempts at self-publicity have backfired and the noise has clearly awakened many of his one-time supporters to the man's blatant hypocrisy if nothing else.
ReplyDeleteYup, it's the old story of the pot calling the kettle black.
ReplyDeleteI'm sure many people new to this blog have no idea what any of you are talking about, with regard to JW. Please supply some URLs to documentary or anecdotal evidence at least, or else it will look like you're making some lame attempts at mudslinging in defence of the schools somewhat sullied reputation, and this whilst hiding behind anonymity no less. Very admirable people you are I must say, much like some of the teachers and priests at St. Benedict's, during "the dark years". Really now people, we are reaching a new low with this cheap spin.
ReplyDeleteLet the 'people' judge, 15:59. Anyone who wishes can trace the history of the above remarks without the slightest difficulty - they just keep reading back over this blog!
ReplyDelete15:59's line - 'Very admirable people you are I must say, much like some of the teachers and priests at St. Benedict's, during "the dark years" - makes him sound suspiciously like Mr West. However, there is, as readers will note, nothing whatsoever 'low' or 'cheap' about that observation.
A BRIEF BEGGINERS' GUIDE
ReplyDeleteThe gist of this blog can be put almost into a couple of sentences. Ostensibly, it’s about child protection. In fact, it's about damning everyone connected with Ealing Abbey and its school. To Mr West's mind they are all tarred with the same brush and guilty by association. Their 'guilt' is connected with proximity to child abuse and/or the covering up of child abuse. Mr West will, it seems, not be happy until all these people are hanged drawn and quartered, for whatever is said or done, in his book, is unsatisfactory.
Many have, from the start, being suspicious of Mr West and his motives. But, recently a number of apparently serious accusations were levelled at Mr West by someone who knows him very well indeed(see last month's postings. These accusations concerned his dealings with children. However, while quick to condemn others for their lack of openness and response, Mr West has had absolutely nothing to say about these unpleasant accusations one way or the other. Inevitably, this strengthens the suspicions that several people have had about Mr West. Okay, that's sort of 'the story so far'; a bit crude you might think, but it’s a fairly crude story anyway.
I just love 15:59 railing against anonymous postings. His own posting, under 'ex-benny boy', is totally transparent of course and allows instant recognition! How refreshing!
ReplyDeletewhat is a begginer?
ReplyDeletePlease don't feed the trolls.
ReplyDeleteSo, there you are you old scallywag, how about some answers?
ReplyDeleteWow - at last the man has spoken. He didn't say much.
ReplyDeleteNo, his role now has to be that of the 'strong silent type'. A bit of a joke for it's a bit like asking Mr Bean to play Romeo!
ReplyDelete.
ReplyDeleteTroll - singular.
.
.
ReplyDeleteA Troll ?*!?
No - it's not a Troll - it's a thrombosis!
Definition to follow
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Having been a pupil at St Benedicts in the 70's i feel that you have all somewhat "lost the plot". It is a shame to see that " anonymous abbey", has no other way of defending Ealing Abbey,St Benedicts school or the Roman Catholic Church, than accusing Jonathan West of child abuse. It is never the less not surprising that "anonymous" resorts to such tactics seeing as the abbey,the school and the church are all so disgracefuly undefendable.I also doubt that he was a pupil in that shameful period of the schools history.(but can understand his sense of frustration if things at St Benedicts changed after the early 80's and he feels that he received a wonderful religious and academic education)
ReplyDeleteWhat i would like to say to "A A",from one ex pupil to another(if that is the case), is IT HAPPENED. In the 70's it was common knowledge and the abuse was not just sexual.Child abuse takes many shapes and forms.It was a period of my life that i still am coming to terms with.There are many,too many pupils who's lives and familys were devastated by that school and you my friend are doing absolutely nothing to help them,the school,the church or yourself by behaving like this.I fear that the problems may be too deep for you to understand.
The Roman Catholic Church wiil not recover from this unless it reforms.Deeply and radicaly.It is too late to convince people like me,who had the misfortune to be in the wrong Benedictine Extremist school at the wrong time,but there is still a chance that Islam will not wipe you off the planet before 2050 as long as you all act swiftly.It has already overtaken you as the "worlds no 1 religion".You are here defending paedophiles instead of thinking about how this could have been avoided,why it was'nt avoided.Who were the men who have so shamefuly brought the church and abbey that you so obviously love into disrepute.How can we bring them to justice.Why arent you channeling your anger towards the likes of Fr Laurence and Fr David.You are behaving exactly like the Catholic Church did fot the past 40 years,trying to cover up and divert attention instead of facing reality and the challenges that await you.
If Jonathan West is doing all this for publicity reasons,i can think of better ways.If being controversial gets him more "hits",he will learn(if he has not already) that in Blogland,being controversial is a very risky business.It has it's pros and cons,but usually cons.I personaly feel that he is providing an important platform for people involved at St Benedicts to express ourselves.I have no interest in being religious or atheist.What i am interested in is JUSTICE. Justice for the victims and there familys and a better understanding as to how this was allowed to go on for so long.If we begin to understand this,we can begin to work on stopping this from ever happening again.
We owe this to the victims,there familys,the abbey,the school,pupils,catholics,atheists and our childrens children.
Amen
I agree with the previous comment (12.22) wholeheartedly I too was a pupil at St Benedict's in the early 1980's. Everything that has been said about that school is true. It was a terrible place to be as a child, and I have to say, the trolling here reminds me of the incessant psychological bullying which came right from the top and permeated the entire school. Laurence Soper, Gregory Chillman and of course David Pearce were and are disgusting men, who tried to compensate for their own inadequacies by bullying children (and worse). These trolls sound exactly like them. Today's parents should know that the kind of bullying behaviour seen here is absolutely integral to St Benedict's and the Abbey. Read every comment here and ask yourself if you'd like your children to spend their formative years in the company of such nasty, vindictive minds. As for their allegations about the blog owner, they have not produced one shred of evidence. Until they do, these unfounded claims should illuminate for you even further their dark, tortured personalities.
ReplyDeleteNo one is denying that bad things happened in the past. That is not the case today. As for the serious allegations against the blog owner, all he has to do is to deny them. They do question his suitability and motivation for his obsessiveness in this matter. If he had a child who was abused, it would be different. People wonder what he is getting out of his activities.
ReplyDelete"what does he get out of it"? anonymous asks. Isn't it rewarding enough to drag the past out into the light? Must we look for ulterior motives? Many of us here who support JWs campaign don't really know him, but we (and him too, probably) may all have some "ulterior motive" or specific thing (or number of things) that set us off, whether it was being bullied, ogled in the showers, treated like animals, or in a few, hopefully exceptional cases, "fiddled with" by pedos, or maybe know of someone that had one or more of the above happen to them. At this time of course, our parents were paying good money for this kind of thing. It's not even specific people who are to blame much of the time - although, there clearly are, SOME of the time. We can certainly pin blame on institutions, traditions and false beliefs to which authority figures remained (and perhaps still remain) enslaved, but it's all good isn't it? It all helps to improve the world for the youth of today, doesn't it? So who's complaining? and why should they? All these years later, the school and those who hold its interests at heart should take all of this on the chin as a well deserved, catharsis of well justified bad feelings. All you "abbey anonymouses" should feel relieved more people aren't all getting together to try and get more damages out of the school (and/or the abbey) in some kind of "class action lawsuit". Such a thing could drag out for years! ... much like the years of abuse I suppose, in one way or another constantly overlooked, or practically encouraged, by the school and abbey authorities. :-/
ReplyDeleteWhen is vengeance/revenge enough?
ReplyDeleteWith the best will in the world, I don’t think anyone could claim that this is a healthy blog. It has not, as one contributor writes, merely ‘lost the plot’ but is, or has become, utterly amorphous. Even the ‘blog owner’ is ambivalent and tries to tug in several different directions at the same time; some of these directions are quite sane, others verge on madness.
Someone has said Mr West’s ‘role’, given the accusations that have been made against him personally, is reduced to one of ‘silence’. Whatever his, or other contributors, ‘role’ it is, in my view, time to bring the curtain down on this particular show.
The Abbey and School are under professional scrutiny not only by Carlile but several other experts. All accusations made against either establishment are being examined, as are the Abbey’s own records. So, as one contributor has put it, ‘what more can be done?’
Mr West has probably performed a useful exercise in analysing the School’s safeguarding policy. But, as there has been little come back on his suggestions and given that Mr West is no expert in these matters, one cannot be sure. Sitting back as ‘an armchair critic‘ is one thing, dealing with what are complex realities, on the ground, is another matter altogether.
In short, for better or worse, this blog has served its purpose, or purposes, and it’s high time for all concerned to move on. We have to face the fact that in this case, as probably in all others, ultimately ‘vengeance’ belongs to God. Or, if ‘God’ is too much, then, let’s say there comes a point at which it is simply beyond our compass. If we ignore this, we are, again, as some contributors have pointed out, destined to succumb to obsession.
Those who continue to feel resentment about the way they have been treated/mistreated in the past have to come to terms with being part of ‘the universal biography’! Hardly anyone remains, to some degree, untouched or unscathed by her or his past experiences. It is sometimes hard to bear, but learning to bear with injustice, etc, is part of the human condition and can even become a positive factor for growth and development – but only if we work at it and stop simply blaming others, even when they have clearly wronged us. This may sound like nonsense, and there are certainly times when we have to ‘lay the blame’, feel passionate anger or outrage and desire vengeance – otherwise we would be unthinking, unfeeling idiots – but we have to get beyond this, or our negativity will overwhelm us and destroy our lives.
So, in future, if anyone has accusations of a serious or criminal kind to make, against the Abbey, the School or Mr West, would they please present them to the proper authorities or leave well alone?
anonymous from 11:00 makes a good effort (if not the best yet) at reconciling the opposing parties commenting on this blog. I have issues however with "vengeance belongs with God", as well as "Those who continue to feel resentment about the way they have been treated/mistreated in the past have to come to terms with being part of ‘the universal biography". Can people have faith in God to avenge their wrongs, and to bear grudges for them? I'm not so sure. After all, they say God helps those who help themselves. As long as (like anonymous says) people don't let "negativity overwhelm and destroy them", there has to be some benefit in "getting back" at those who have done you wrong. Even unpleasant emotions such as anger or hate can give strength, or "feed strength", for some. There is a time for forgiveness, but it can't be anytime and all the time. Mahatma Gandhi made a good point once: “The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong.” This all makes for a highly interesting debate I'm sure, and I expect someone will put forward the Christian viewpoint on this very subject very soon now, right here. The Christian point of view is absolutely valid, desirable, and a high ideal for all of humanity, but it just doesn't always work in the real world.
ReplyDeleteSorry to disappoint you, 13:10, but, in the 'real world', it seems we have not a great deal of choice! Crime of whatever degree is either dealt with by criminals, along the lines of 'an eye for an eye', or by the judicial system. Often, it is true, the system leaves a lot to be desired - in some cases, in fact, ‘Justice’ seems to have little to do with the matter. It is, indeed, not for nothing that the Law is referred to as 'an ass'! But, short of vigilantism, it's the best we've managed to come up with. That may be ‘cold comfort’ and do little to sooth 'the savage breast' but simply going over the same ground, time and time again, week in and week out hardly represents a viable alternative.
ReplyDeletePost Scriipt to 14:01. Though quite understandable, this 'going over the same ground' really does not belong on a blog. It can only be dealt with, creatively, in some kind of therapeutic setting. Sadly, few of us are prepared to admit, even to ourselves, that we need this kind of help. I'm not particularly religious but I can't help remembering that even Christ needed help in carrying his cross.
ReplyDeleteI'm glad the level of debate has improved int he last 24 hours and I'm grateful both to ex-benny and his interlocutor - who in trying to show why this blog isn't healthy demonstrates precisely why it is!
ReplyDeleteI was badly scarred by my experiences at St Benedict's but do not feel able to contribute to Carlile's review - which I do not trust - or to go to any other authority at present. However, I have found this blog and the comments posted in it to be extremely therapeutic.
As for vengeance - I believe it is real and necessary and has not even begun to be visited upon those who are guilty of ruining so many lives. For the sake of those pupils who are currently at St Benedict's, as well as those who will go there in the future, the school has to be dealt with in a way that makes it as safe an environment for children as any state school.
thanks 21:01 - I've been wondering whether we're sitting around beating a dead horse, but if it gets people one one side riled up, and people on the other side feeling better by talking about it, or ignite a debate, then it is indeed good therapy and well worth the time. You mention St. Benedicts needs to have "as safe an environment for children as any state school", and there indeed is the biggest part of the rub: people sent their kids to Bennys, counting firstly [?] on a higher quality, private and thus conceivably "higher class" environment and academic education, and secondly perhaps on the comfort of the non-secular, quasi-religious environment (although it's true you also get free/public Catholic schools), and the irony was that for so many of us (and possibly for some of our parents, if they ever bothered to open their eyes), it was all somewhat disappointing, so you wonder to what degree the academic side (arguably still superior to that which we'd have had in the state sector) suffered as a result of the other stuff. Though it could be argued as a very subjective thing to say, most people I know that went to a state school while I went to Bennys seemed to come out somewhat better adjusted than anyone I know that went to Bennys. Discussing the problem of bullying with a friend who went to Ealing Green (considering sex abuse doesn't even enter the discussion - most likely you need priests for that), I asked "did you have bullying?", and the answer was "yes - there were bigger/older kids who extorted lunch money from younger kids, and once this came to light, they were made to take part in a kind of (police style) line-up, and if identified, were then expelled". Apart from this they also had (although somewhat exceptionally I would understand) some more serious violence from time to time, to the point of needing police attention - but still basically bullying. These scenarios struck me as fairly simple, compared to the bizarre world of Bennys (lower key but more constant physical and verbal violence), but then we're getting off the subject of pedo abuse, and onto the subject of bullying. To what degree can we blame some of the pupils themselves for the way they were, and to what degree can we blame the school and its teaching staff for the quality of pastoral care it provided, if this is what made some of those pupils into what they were, or brought out the worst in them? I sometimes thought (and still occasionally think) I was weak for not coping with all the BS in that school better by doing more violence, and meeting violence with greater violence (although I did that too on occasion), but I realise now I was stronger for not going along with it all, not getting sucked in to that way of life, despite being exposed to these people day in day out. On the other hand, I came out bitter, and still have bitter feelings about the school. That in itself has to be a sad reflection on the school. Even so, I don't wish to be unfair to the school - if I'm objective about the whole thing, I realise maybe 60-70% of the problem was down to the school being boys only [?], leading to a thoroughly testosterone fueled, somewhat (and unnecessarily) harsh, jungle atmosphere, but whatever the other 30-40% of the problem was, that didn't help a lot either. Putting outright abuse to one side for the moment as still fairly exceptional, could better pastoral care have tipped the scale and made the whole experience better for so many of us? There's the question, and if the answer is yes, then there's the rub.
ReplyDeleteex-benny
ReplyDeleteWithout the more generally oppressive atmosphere involving bullying that you have described, the sex abuse couldn't have gone on for as long as it did. It was the oppressive atmosphere which made a major contribution to making it really hard for victims to come forward.